It took a while but here is the translated and transcribed second part of the interview between "Pura Politica" host Juan Manuel Benitez and New York State Senator Ruben Diaz, Sr. that ran a week ago today on New York 1 Noticias. Elements of this segment have been already been translated by Tony Varona and posted at Pam's House Blend ("Anti-gay NY State Senator Rev. Ruben Diaz grilled on NY1 Spanish channel"). This is a rawer translation, keeping intact some turns in phrasing as well as sudden changes from present to past tenses, as spoken by interviewer and interviewee during the broadcast - which might make it a little hard to read. A couple of comments before posting the video:
- At the 6:40, in attempting to justify his opposition to the 1994 Gay Games in New York, Reverend Diaz invokes the name of basketball player Michael Jordan in arguing that Jordan was barred from entering other countries due to his HIV status. The Reverend seems to be confusing Michael Jordan with Earvin "Magic" Johnson, Jr., who had announced he was HIV positive back in 1991.
- It's truly jaw-dropping to hear the Reverend claim he's just a single individual with some unpopular views and that he would have never, ever, mounted any effort to defeat any effort to advance LGBT-rights if only he'd been left alone. As Benitez says, he has single-handedly made opposing LGBT-rights the main pillar of his political career. Never mind that he is not "just" a single individual: He is a State Senator with the power to influence thousands of people with a single vote.
- A few people online are already noted that at the end of the interview, at the 10:40 mark, the Reverend seems to admit that he used to be gay. "I used to be a homosexual", he seems to say before catching himself and talking about being a former drug addict. It's obviously an accidental slip of the tongue. I'm not sure what good it serves for people to use it to argue that the man must be a closeted bigot as some are doing already online. The man is a bigot, but those who keep waiting for a rent-boy to pop up and expose the Reverend as being gay will probably wait until the end of the world. Not that I would really want the Reverend to be on our team, even if he insists in this interview that he could very well become gay overnight if he put himself up to it.
- Apparently, as the Reverend has said before and says once again in this interview, he respects Blabbeando for its impartiality. I appreciate his sentiments but want to make clear that no economic exchanges were made in return for the free publicity (a joke, people, a joke).
- Finally, I might be biased on the issue, but I really cannot stop myself from admiring the amazing job Juan Manuel Benitez has done in digging at Diaz in this and previous interviews by being respectful, direct, persistent and insistent. In this, and other previous interviews, you can see that he gets under the Reverend's skin when Diaz begins to stutter and mumble at a momentary loss of words. It really cuts through his "I'm not a homophobe" façade and exposes him for whom he truly is.
- A couple of exchanges stand out as my favorites and they might not be the ones you suspect: The first one comes at the 6:03 mark when the Reverend is trying to portray himself as an innocent victim of attacks by the LGBT community. In response, Benitez cuts straight through the Reverend's BS reminding him his whole political career has been about opposing LGBT rights. Benitez tells him: "You can't throw a stone and then hide your hands"
- The second comes at the 4:50 mark, when the Reverend tries to justify his boycott of El Diario La Prensa by saying that they never cover religious activities such as the Day of the Pastor or children's parades he has organized in the past. Benitez' response to the Reverend?: "Perhaps they only cover is what they consider to be newsworthy". You know, like first communions and such. Just priceless.
JUAN MANUEL BENITEZ: Senator, aren't you afraid that 10, 20, 30 years from now, when they make documentaries about this issue - an issue that is already unstoppable; each day there are more countries and more states that recognize marriages between couples of the same gender - you will be seen as one of those politicians you see in documentaries from the 1950's, 1960's, who opposed civil rights. That you will be seen as one of those politicians when history looks back?
SEN. RUBEN DIAZ, SR.: OK, there are several things I am going to say. First of all. Mayor Bloomberg and those people who dare - DARE! - to compare the suffering, the enslavement, the deportations, the assaults against the African-American community; from Africa, how they took them away from their families, brought them in ships, chained them up, sold them as slaves. People such as Mayor Bloomberg, who dare to compare that to the issue of the homosexual lifestyle, to compare the two is to disrespect - to abuse and disrespect - the black community. And black people - the black community - should not sustain... should respond and not allow the suffering and slavery of the black community to be used as a comparison to the lifestyle of the homosexual community. That is disrespectful to the black community.
SEN. RUBEN DIAZ, SR.: Second: Those states that allow civil marriages [between same-sex partners] haven't done so because the people have voted for it. The people of each state - including California - each state where the people has been given the opportunity to vote, people have rejected it. Now, what has happened is that millionaires like Bloomberg come in, take a bunch of money, they buy out legislators and vote them in, and thus the legislature imposes it on the public.
JUAN MANUEL BENITEZ: The end of racial segregation was also not decided by voters; instead it was by order of the Supreme Court and also by direct order of the president of the United States...
SEN. RUBEN DIAZ, SR.: I'll say it again, I'll say it again; compare it to the Jews. The Jews won't allow anyone to make comparisons to their suffering and their...
JUAN MANUEL BENITEZ: But you have to admit that the homosexual community has also had their suffering and that they still suffer attacks by...
SEN. RUBEN DIAZ, SR.: As have we, the Puerto Ricans, the Hispanics, as we have had, the Hispanics, the Puerto Ricans...
JUAN MANUEL BENITEZ: In other words, you do not deny they have suffered...
SEN. RUBEN DIAZ, SR.: Just like fat people, just like... in this world, discrimination is massive. Ourselves as Hispanics, ourselves as Puerto Ricans, we felt it when we came to this country an we still experience it, wherever we are. But to compare that with the suffering and the civil rights of blacks... with the suffering of black slavery in the United States and the entire world... that is disrespectful to the back community.
JUAN MANUEL BENITEZ: But many in the homosexual community can also say that you have also been disrespectful on many occasions. [If there has been] a fundamental pillar in your career and your political life it's been your opposition to the homosexual community. Let's look at this: In 2003, you stood against the expansion of a high school for homosexual students with a lawsuit...
SEN. RUBEN DIAZ, SR.: I don't think, I don't think public funds...
JUAN MANUEL BENITEZ: And in 1994, you complained against the staging of the "Gay Games" athletic event in New York City and you stated, at that time, "some of the gay and lesbian athletes could already be infected with AIDS" and you also said "children could also come to the conclusion that if there are so many gay and lesbian athletes, then there is nothing wrong about it, there are no risks". Don't you think that the homosexual community might feel hurt by these comments? And because the fundamental pillar of your political career has been as such.
SEN. RUBEN DIAZ, SR.: But hold on a second. Where are we living? We are living in America. We are living in the United States of America where there is freedom of expression, and freedom means that you might agree with something and I have the right to be in disagreement. Now, you'll take away my freedom to decide what I believe in and what I don't believe in?
JUAN MANUEL BENITEZ: One more time: You are banning the right of homosexual people to choose to marry the people they fall in love with.
SEN. RUBEN DIAZ, SR.: No, I'm saying... no, no... fall in love with whoever you want, my brother. You can fall in love with whomever, and have pleasure with whomever, and get involved with... What I'm teling you is that I don't approve of marriage and I won't vote for it with my vote. But... have pleasure with whomever you find, fall in love with whomever, I'm not telling you who to fall in love with.
JUAN MANUEL BENITEZ: This freedom of expression, to say what you want to say, don't you extend it to El Diario La Prensa? You've been organizing a boycott based on the editorial content of El Diario La Prensa because they back same-sex marriage...
SEN. RUBEN DIAZ, SR.: And abortion, and abortion, because...
JUAN MANUEL BENITEZ: So you want to silence El Diario La Prensa's freedom of expression.
SEN. RUBEN DIAZ, SR.: No, I want to be granted equality. I want to be granted equality.
JUAN MANUEL BENITEZ: And what is equality. Which is the equality.
SEN. RUBEN DIAZ, SR.: Equality means that El Diario La Prensa doesn't cover any of our activities. They don't cover our children's parades...
JUAN MANUEL BENITEZ: They did cover your rally from a couple of weeks back...
SEN. RUBEN DIAZ, SR.: Nooooo, oh, man, it was just miniscule coverage. They don't cover the Day of the Pastor, they don't cover religious activities, they don't cover a thing. They only cover...
JUAN MANUEL BENITEZ: Perhaps they only cover is what they consider to be newsworthy...
SEN. RUBEN DIAZ, SR.: So us... the Evangelical people don't have the right... We don't have to invest 50 cents to buy it. That doesn't... that doesn't... we are in America!
JUAN MANUEL BENITEZ: You are taking away the freedom of expression from them.
SEN. RUBEN DIAZ, SR.: Ah! So is it an attack... for... for... for us to inhibit our right to express our position. Give me equality, and let's say we'll be on even keel. I'm not saying 'Do not write about that'. What I'm saying is: Why is it that you write only about that side... and don't write about this side. Journalism should be impartial. Which is what I just told you about Blabbeando. Blabbeando. Look, what I said to you about Blabbeando, is that I respect Blabbeando because he's impartial in his writing...
JUAN MANUEL BENITEZ: Blabbeando is a blog you have mentioned on other occasions in this program... but each newspaper has their editorial track and their opinion track, and their editorial is their editorial. That's where the editors express their opinion.
SEN. RUBEN DIAZ, SR.: So we have no... / No, no... not their editorials, their entire content: They don't cover us and if they block us... in other words, journalism in America should be impartial. It should cover this and it should cover that. But if it's only going to cover one side...
JUAN MANUEL BENITEZ: But it would appear that you use these arguments are your liking but then turn them around when they are of no benefit to you...
SEN. RUBEN DIAZ, SR.: Well, I live in America and I am nothing more than a single individual, I don't understand why so many people have a problem when I am a single individual; there are so many millionaires and so much press contributing in favor of homosexual marriage; why is it that I am the one who is being attacked now.
JUAN MANUEL BENITEZ: Because you know - once again, I repeat this to you - you have based a fundamental pillar in your career doing this. In other words, you can't throw a stone and then hide your hands.
SEN. RUBEN DIAZ, SR.: It's not because I've wanted to. Not me, not me, not me. It's themselves, and it brings us publicity - when they start attacking me. If they'd leave me alone, I wouldn't do a thing. I'm just stating my position.
JUAN MANUEL BENITEZ: You have said... you have said... you have made some comments that are... that many consider to be insults.
SEN. RUBEN DIAZ, SR.: They are not insults. What I am saying there, what I am saying there, first of all: When the Olympic games arrived, Michael Jordan was banned from leaving this country, and other countries over there - outside of the United States - banned Michael Jordan's entry because he had AIDS. And so, when they over there... yes... and I said, why do we have to permit entry to those who come here and those from here, our people, are prohibited from entering there. That's what I said...
JUAN MANUEL BENITEZ: ...and that children would think there was nothing wrong with being homosexual...
SEN. RUBEN DIAZ, SR.: I still say that, I still say that...
JUAN MANUEL BENITEZ: You still say that...
SEN. RUBEN DIAZ, SR.: Of course!
JUAN MANUEL BENITEZ: Do you then think... you do not deserve, then, those campaigns staged against you, don't you deserve them after saying... after making such comments about the homosexual community?
SEN. RUBEN DIAZ, SR.: No, what I am saying... I took the position that for me homosexuality - as a pastor, as a minister, biblically - should not be.
JUAN MANUEL BENITEZ: And I wanted to ask you, I have two questions, but we have to go quickly to end this segment. First, aren't you afraid to end up like those pastors who announced the end of the world last week - with all those tragedies that will occur if homosexual marriage is adopted - after observing that many countries throughout the world - those who warned that something would happen, that a tragedy would occur - that hasn't happened. Do you think you'll be left like those pastors who announced the end of the world?
SEN. RUBEN DIAZ, SR.: I announce the end of the world.
JUAN MANUEL BENITEZ: When?
SEN. RUBEN DIAZ, SR.: Whenever God decides it's time...
JUAN MANUEL BENITEZ: Ah! Of course, that's how you hedge your bets!
SEN. RUBEN DIAZ, SR.: No, no, no. It's just what the Bible says. According to the Bible, Lord Jesus Christ said that not even the angels sitting at...
JUAN MANUEL BENITEZ: But let me ask you. Do you not fear being left behind like those charlatan pastors who announce the end of the world as they did last week and, in the end, they have to backtrack because this world did not end?
SEN. RUBEN DIAZ, SR.: Left behind as what? Are you calling me a charlatan because I oppose homosexual marriage?
JUAN MANUEL BENITEZ: No! Because I am telling you that you claim that if homosexual marriage is adopted all kind of awful things will happen to society - and that it's been legalized in other countries and none of that has happened - when you are basing it on an opinion but not on data or facts!
SEN. RUBEN DIAZ, SR.: And why not spend that money on a more common system, ask for a referendum, and allow the 20 million residents of the State of New York to say whether they want it or not. Why impose it, by buying out Senate votes, buying out their minds and buying out their conscience.
JUAN MANUEL BENITEZ: And to end, Senator: You also released a press statement on Thursday in response to Mayor Bloomberg addressing the "homosexual lifestyle". "Why defend the homosexual lifestyle". Do you then believe that this is a "lifestyle" that can be chosen? Do you think that homosexuals wake up one morning and say "I am going to fall in love with someone of the same gender".
SEN. RUBEN DIAZ, SR.: I believe, I believe, I believe that it is, I believe, I believe that it's a homosexual behavior - because there are homosexuals who have changed their behavior...
JUAN MANUEL BENITEZ: And so, let me ask you: If it's a choice, by that same rule, you could wake up tomorrow... get up tomorrow and say "I am going to fall in love with a man".
SEN. RUBEN DIAZ, SR.: I could.
JUAN MANUEL BENITEZ: You think you can?
SEN. RUBEN DIAZ, SR.: Yes, I could.
JUAN MANUEL BENITEZ: In other words, you'd be capable of that.
SEN. RUBEN DIAZ, SR.: I'm not sure if Id' be capable of it but it could happen.
JUAN MANUEL BENITEZ: It could happen...
SEN. RUBEN DIAZ, SR.: It could happen that many people will get up tomorrow with an atrophied and different mind, and change things. I was... Me, when I became born again, when I arrived... Look, I left drugs behind.
JUAN MANUEL BENITEZ: But... are you comparing - one more time - something...
SEN. RUBEN DIAZ, SR.: I left drugs behind. And my mind changed: One day I said "No more". I left drugs behind. And here I am.
JUAN MANEL BENITEZ: In other words, being homosexual is akin to being addicted to drugs...
SEN. RUBEN DIAZ, SR.: Ah, it's that you all, you know, it's impossible. It isn't true...
JUAN MANUEL BENITEZ: But that's the comparison you just made!
SEN. RUBEN DIAZ, SR.: No. I am comparing what one can change from one day to another, change one's mind. I was telling you who I was. But you insist on looking for the turn of the screw and tomorrow the blogs will go crazy. "Look what he said!" "Look what he is comparing it to!" I am not saying that. What I am saying is, I used to be homo... [laughs] see? You have... I was, er, addicted to drugs. I left the armed forces with a vicious addiction to drugs and straight to the United States and I was deep into vice. One day, all of a sudden, I changed my mind and from then on, I wasn't anymore. What I am saying - but I wasn't born addicted to drugs. I wasn;t born addicted to drugs.
JUAN MANUEL BENITEZ: That's where we'll leave it. Thank you so much for being here.